Monday 12 August 2013

Know your rites!

H/T to Elaine who pointed me in this direction.

We rarely sit back and take stock of the differences between the Tridentine Latin Mass and the Novus Ordo.

It is important that we do lest we forget that, in reality, the two forms of Mass are poles apart.

This film clip gives some but not all of the distinctions, new versus old, crass versus reverent.


 

9 comments:

  1. It is high time we had an objective assessment of the post-Vatican II New Mass.

    It is now clear that although this Mass is valid, it is profoundly theologically misleading and implicitly in error. It must be reformed, as in Benedict’s proposed “Reform of the Reform”, otherwise it will continue to lead the faithful astray, and the Church will continue its disastrous decline.

    Paul VI showed profound lack of judgement in allowing the initial format, but the subsequent unauthorised further alterations were worse. Essentially, the Reformers attacked the concepts of the Mass as a Redemptive Sacrifice, the Real Presence in Holy Communion, and the Ordained Priesthood acting “in Persona Christi”. There were also misguided attempts, in a false sense of Ecumenism, to Protestantise the Mass by changing it into an inward directed commemorative meal, by destroying the idea of the sanctuary, and by laicising so many priestly functions. Personally, I think the most absurd and embarrassing addition is the post Pater Noster doxology “For Thyne etc.” something which the Protestants thought up, and which does not occur in scripture.

    We should all constantly try to persuade our priests to phase these aberrations, including that optional and disruptive sign of peace, out of our Mass.

    And until they do, go whenever you can, to a Traditional Catholic Mass.

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    1. Doesn't the doxolog appear in the Didache? So the Protestants thought it up in AD 100?

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  2. The video clearly sets out the difference between the two rites.The Novus Ordo has been a disaster for the catholic church.Often scandalous and sacrilegious it has clearly had a protestantising effect.Even when celebrated in latin and with reverence it is still defective when compared with the TLM due to the changing of the offetory prayers and the supression of prayers of a sacrifical nature.It is not a reform of the reform that is required but a wholesale return to the TLM with the Novus Ordo being consigned to the dustbin of history.As things stand at present I am more likely to see pigs flying past my window than for this to happen.

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  3. Nick,

    The Doxology wasn't in the original Scriptures. It was added onto the Our Father by the early Jewish Christians who were used to ending their prayers with concluding verses and so attached "For thine is the kingdom, the power, and the glory, now and forever" as an appropriate verse to end the prayer with.

    This probably will surprise a lot of people, but Catholic Bibles do not include the Doxology. (See Matthew 6: 9-14) By the time of Henry VIII this was well-known and the first English translations of the Our Father omitted the Doxology (while Henry was still in communion with the Church). However, Elizabeth I, to disassociate the Church of England from anything Catholic, stuck the Doxology back onto the prayer. I grew up in the pre-Vatican II Church and we *never* said the Doxology at Mass at the end of the Our Father. However, when the Novus Ordo came along the Doxology was added onto the prayer at Mass as a sop to the Protestants, all of whom as far as I can remember said it at their services.

    The idea was that the more Protestant we became the more the Protestants would want to become Catholics because we'd be more like them so then they'd happily want to join us, right? Well, we all know how that worked out, don't we?

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    1. I'm aware that the doxology doesn't appear in Scripture. I'm aware that it doesn't appear in the usus antiquior. But to say that Protestants thought it up? I'm pretty sure that didn't happen like that.

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    2. Touche, Nick, you're right. Sorry I can't do accents or is it acutes, on this computor.

      But the Protestants, as from the 17th century cetainly used it to show how un-Catholic they were.
      I seem to remember (in the scouts), we Catholic scouts remaining fiercely and fumingly silent while our Protestant fellow scouts prattled on, looking down their noses at us. It was very much an issue then.

      Therefore, its inclusion in the New Mass was an attempt, and a crass one at that, to misguidely Ecumenise us.


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    3. Nick,

      Let me be more explicit. Christians living in the Eastern half of the Roman Empire added the Doxology to the Our Father when reciting the prayer at Mass. Evidence of this practice shows up in the Didache. Greek scribes, when copying the New Testament, also sometimes added the Doxology onto the Our Father. In the Latin Rite in the Western half of the Roman Empire this wasn't done. The earliest English translations were in accordance with the Latin Rite as everyone was a Roman Catholic. During the reign of Elizabeth I, to rid the Church of England from any Catholic (i.e. Latin) vestiges the Doxology was added back onto the Lord's Prayer. The irony is that Protestants often accuse Catholics of not being faithful to the Gospel text when in fact they are the ones who added verses that shouldn't be there.

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    4. Jacobi, I have Protestant family...and when they lead the Our Father us Catholics do the same thing!

      Alright, I see the history in a more complete picture now! Thanks y'all

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  4. The Novus Ordo also has changed or even eliminated the Confiteor. Here in the U.S. there's Plan A and Plan B. Plan A is saying the Confiteor minus the intercession of the Angels and Saints or even the priest. Plan B substitutes individual prayer for communal prayer.

    The change came about because Protestants don't believe that Mary or the Saints can intercede for us. To them that's something superstitious Catholics do. Ditto for confessing to a priest which smacks of Confession (another Protestant no-no) And soooo . . . to make the Mass more welcoming to Protestants out went the Saints (and the priest) and instead we ask our brothers and sisters sitting in the pews to pray for us. (This also is why we tossed out the Salve Regina and the Prayer to St. Michael at the end of Mass.) Now the Protestants can feel that our Church is really their Church and so they'll come and join us, right? See above.

    Sigh . . .

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